Curse

Kai Nui · Jul 18, 2006, 05:12 AM // 05:12

I say get rid of them and join them with other already made classes. Let the current people who own them chose which way they want to go and let people change their items into weapons or staffs with the same mods of a different weapon.

Join assassin into mesmer and warrior and Ritualist into ranger, necromancer, elementalist, and monk and maybe a combo of what fits well with what. Spirits to rangers, ashes to necromancers, etc...

Why? Simply because it makes no sense at all to add classes. It's a big mistake in my oppinion. I do think they should add new things, but I don't believe they should waste making new classes and crap.

It's already an innovative idea to use ashes, if necromancer class got those, it'd be quite extrodinary and add to their arsenal while attacking spirits would be good for rangers. Combination skills are great for warriors as a new way for attacking, although we might have to get rid of daggers, it's not that huge of a loss.

This may sound very ridiculous, but it actually makes sense. It keeps the game on the basis of skill and gives an actual purpose to buying future chapters for pvp. Sure there are a lot of complications such as swapping armors, characters, and more over, but I think it'd be worth it to keep the 6 core classes instead of adding in akward pieces of shit like ritualists and assassins to completely screw up the current system going on. It makes no sense at all to me. :/

unholy guardian · Jul 18, 2006, 05:36 AM // 05:36

Well yes and no. It really is just a musuraat hammer in the groin for buying factions to play an assassin or a ritualist. I can understand the idea to just want to give skills to the core classes, but still what does that mean for all the concept classes? Well those probably wouldn't be implemented, but still.

Problem is the inner revolutionist, and the commercial on the discorvery channel is telling me "open your eyes and shut your mouth!"

I would watch out for the fire, it's going to get hot around here probably lol.

Still change is good, and so far it really isn't unbalancing anything at the moment.

Problem is "purpose for buying chapters" is different for each person getting the game.

I still understand what you are saying, but no way can i agree to it, it just doesn't make enough sense to remove such a thing... espcially now.

TadaceAce · Jul 18, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

.... um no? Flaming not gonna happen here... wait I lied... this is absolutely asenine proposal.

arcanemacabre · Jul 18, 2006, 05:50 AM // 05:50

This is purely a discussion/argument/flame thread and not an idea/concept thread. Why? Because there's no chance in hell Anet would suddenly remove two character classes that they spent so long in creating and balancing, especially months down the road after development/release. So, realistically, it ain't gonna happen.

Now, my personal opinion is also a "No way". I love my ritualist and find her quite unique. I may not like Assassins too much, but I see their uses as well. They don't ruin any balance by themselves. They may mix things up and add new strategies and flavor to builds and what-not, but I don't see why anyone would think that was a bad thing.

If you don't like any new class, then don't play it. If you don't like to fight with/against others with those classes, learn to adapt. More options, as long as they are balanced, is never a bad thing.

actionjack · Jul 18, 2006, 05:53 AM // 05:53

Question Kai Nui, assume we don't get new classes in future chapter, meaning the lost of new character animation, new playing style, new weapons and look, a refreshing way to start over again, more combo choice that we would not get with just 6, and for many, the incentive to play again.... Do you think the marketing, or the copies that the new chapter would get sold, would go up or down?

Would Faction sold 2 milion if it follow what you said?

Guardian of the Light · Jul 18, 2006, 05:55 AM // 05:55

You think they're going to take actually going to take this. Geez man I understand what your coming form but come on I hate it and it's not gonna happen.

If you can't tell already. /NOTSIGNED!

Caleb · Jul 18, 2006, 06:30 AM // 06:30

Please merge monks with warriors and elementalists all into one class and call them Pikachu.

/leave my characters alone

Kai Nui · Jul 18, 2006, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjack

Question Kai Nui, assume we don't get new classes in future chapter, meaning the lost of new character animation, new playing style, new weapons and look, a refreshing way to start over again, more combo choice that we would not get with just 6, and for many, the incentive to play again.... Do you think the marketing, or the copies that the new chapter would get sold, would go up or down?

Would Faction sold 2 milion if it follow what you said?

Well this is how I see it: Just because you don't add more classes doesn't mean you can't add in new stuff. Like I said, if you put in the attacking spirits into Ranger class from the start it'd be great, just like ashes for necromancers in death magic and spread out between soul reaping and the sort. It would be giving us more skills instead of giving us a pathetic 25 skills per class for buying factions which was worthless. They didn't add in enough to make enough of a difference to the core classes and focused on two new classes for no reason. The game is based on skill, and if I don't have access to certain class types because I haven't bought a chapter, then I am screwed hard. On the other hand if I don't have access to a different array of skills, then that's still bad but at least you're still basically fighting a necromancer instead of something completely foreign. Yes it's quite a radical idea but it makes perfect sense. Perhaps making attributes that are to certain chapters would be better. For instance Death Magic would be Tyrian while Cremation Magic would be the Canthan thing.

You'd be giving new content to old classes to make them have a larger array of materials to deal with, and here are some examples I made up to show what I mean:

Mesmer might get some illusion skills in different chapters to rewind the last 5...10 seconds of time to undo everything that has happened between characters or alter what has happened time wise. Completely new, yet fits in to the mesmer class well

Give the monk healing spells that work like attacks, so if your ally is kiting they can actually dodge their own healing accidentally, but they also have to catch them to get healed.

Add a set of skills for rangers that differ depending on if you have a higher % of life than your % of energy and vise versa. if your life percentage is higher you lose all energy, and if your energy percentage is higher, your arrows steal 5...10 life just as an example.

Give necromancers more blood ritual type skills that up the stats of other classes such as if target ally has any skills level 9 or lower they are raised by one point for 5..25 seconds. Make them more of a monk but stat enhancing not life enhancing.

Now I realize those aren't the most creative things out there, but if they put their time towards reinventing the old classes to seem like completely new ones, it'd be great. What if you had started in chapter three and knew necromancers to be wise communers of passed away spirits, warriors as combo creaters, and mesmers to teleport and change time, with monks enhancing stats (I know I said necro above, but whatever)

Hopefully that can further explain what I mean. The basic ideas of classes would remain the same, but they would differentiate considerably as almost completely different classes between chapters.

Keep the core, don't add random crap like assassins and ritualists out of nowhere for no reason... it doesn't make any sense to me. If they add more and more professions eventually the game will lose the foundation of skill and become a piece of trash with 2 new classes every chapter? by the end of chapter 5 we'd have 14 classes... That sounds a bit cheesy to me, that's not what Guild Wars is.

damocles · Jul 18, 2006, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Let me ask you first: Do you own Factions?

While I was reading your post you said it make no sense to make add new characters to the game. But you aren't giving any reason why it would be better without the Assassin and Ritualist

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai Nui

This may sound very ridiculous, but it actually makes sense. It keeps the game on the basis of skill and gives an actual purpose to buying future chapters for pvp. Sure there are a lot of complications such as swapping armors, characters, and more over, but I think it'd be worth it to keep the 6 core classes instead of adding in akward pieces of shit like ritualists and assassins to completely screw up the current system going on. It makes no sense at all to me. :/

1. It does sound rediculous and it makes no sense at all.
2. The Ritualist and Assassin have given a new aspect to PvP and PvE. PvP is still a matter of skill.
3. New implented things: A new PvE adventure, new characters, new weapons, new PvP modes and a new world are reasons for me (and I think for most players in the community) to purchase the game.
4. I haven't seen a lot of screwing up of the system by Rits and Assa's.

In my opinion we shouldn't get rid of this (and I think I'm speaking for a lot of people in GW)

EDIT:

Quote:

if you put in the attacking spirits into Ranger class from the start it'd be great, just like ashes for necromancers in death magic and spread out between soul reaping and the sort.

I don't get it why you would still add these skills to the other classes if you think the Rit and Assa are screwing up the system. Now the Ranger and Necromancer are screwing up the system

Quote:

The game is based on skill, and if I don't have access to certain class types because I haven't bought a chapter, then I am screwed hard.

Indeed the game is based on skill, player skill that is. Aren't you screwed just as hard if they would have implented the Rit and Assa skills into the 6 core classes? You still have to purchase the chapter to get access to these skills. So again it doesn't make sense of getting rid of those 2.

Quote:

Keep the core, don't add random crap like assassins and ritualists out of nowhere for no reason... it doesn't make any sense to me. If they add more and more professions eventually the game will lose the foundation of skill and become a piece of trash with 2 new classes every chapter? by the end of chapter 5 we'd have 14 classes... That sounds a bit cheesy to me, that's not what Guild Wars is.

I do agree with you that 14 classes is a bit to much when we get to Chapter 5. But maybe then the game is already dead or they implented new things that it might work.

Kai Nui · Jul 18, 2006, 07:20 AM // 07:20

Yeah, I know it doesn't make a lot of sense... in my mind it does lol. I do own factions and I've beaten both quite thoroughly. I just hate this idea of coming out with new classes when they're just so similar to what we already have. What new stuff does assassin really bring that we don't already have? If they just implemented them into the 6 core, I would have felt like I bought something. Now all I do is PVP and quite frankly the "new" skills from factions is so little that it's pathetic. If they had just augmented the current classes with say 50-60 new skills each that were different from the norm but still fit in to what was there, we'd have more variety between classes. Current examples would be degen illusion mesmers and IW illusion mesmers. Future examples might be ash death necros, minion death necros, and out of body death necros. You'd still have the same classes around and instead of having something like factions with 8 classes and prophecies with 6 (later down the road I see this as an issue, not now) you'd have different types of death magic or illusion magic depending on your chapter. You'd still be playing as a necro with a small limitation to having full access, but you'd still have core and campaign whereas currently you can have core, campaign, and you have to own factions to have additional classes. Hopefully that makes more sense. I do realize it is quite a change to take place, but I think in the long run it would make sense. How would you like to play guild wars in chapter 5 and only have access to the 6 core classes and 2 of it's campaign then play against a team of chapter 4,3, and 2s with assassin, ritualists, pokemasters, and nurses when none of those characters even exist in PVE to practice on or even have any clue as to what potential they have? It's adding new rules to the game and even though right now it doesn't seem like an issue, later down the road it'll be a big problem.

BaconSoda · Jul 18, 2006, 07:23 AM // 07:23

I have to say, this is the most inane and ridonculous thing I've heard anyone say since I was six years old...The Ritualist and Assassin were one of the best things Anet added to Guild Wars. Mentioning that by chapter 5 we'll have 14 classes makes no difference, after all, how many class/race combinations does the most played MMO in the world (WoW) have (i think that's it....)? Now adding new attributes would cause utter confusion en masse among the masses...After 5 chapters then, 8 new classes worth of skills would be stuffed into our skill bars, and not everyone would have access to specific attributes. The 2 new classes are a way to keep the new attributes orginized and interesting. Also, at the current state of the skills locations (class wise), 3/4 of the assassin woukld be put into Warriors, with Shadow Arts put into mesmers. Does anyone else see something becoming unbalanced now? Overall, this is ridonculous, and is never going to happen. Now, a way to fix the balancing of classes to the release of the new chapters is to only give each new chapter 6 classes (meaning that 2 would be unavailable to factions, 4 to chapter 3 and so-on). That is a plausible suggestion now, is it not?

Kai Nui · Jul 18, 2006, 07:31 AM // 07:31

Then the person who has bought the most recent chapter would have no need for buying later ones because they have a whole core and campaign set of skills, whoop dee doo, are they going to really spend 60 dollars per chapter just for about 25 skills and some copies? I don't really think so, especially since 2 of thier classes won't get anything anyway. Yeah it seems unbalanced to put the skills into the current classes, but no one said we can't change the current skills to fit better and even create more to make up for some of the lost space. I'm not proposing keeping the exact same skills we have, nor am I proposing that we create new attributes either. So what if WoW has 14 classes or not, guild wars is about skills, if I am making a TA build, I shouldn't have to make such a broad skill set with my 8 skills that I can counter 2 classes with one skill... because I use res sig.

fenix · Jul 18, 2006, 07:44 AM // 07:44

...you can't be serious. This is the stupidest post I've seen. Not only does no one in the game want the classes removed, Anet wouldn't even discuss it in passing. It would be like removing Random Arenas from the game (although, that'd be pretty good).

shardfenix · Jul 18, 2006, 07:47 AM // 07:47

Wow. Simply...wow.
While you're at it, ask arenanet to not add new storylines, or new realms of the gods, or new skills, or new weapon sknis.
How about they release expansions with only new core professions skills. I'd certainly pay 50 bucks for that.
[/sarcasm]
Before I get banned for flaming again, i am not flaming. I am completely serious. The new professions are the ONLY reason people buy the expansions. I know I wouldn't want an expansion if all it gave me was a so-so story and crap core profession skills.

mega_jamie · Jul 18, 2006, 08:19 AM // 08:19

I agree that rangers should maybe get attacking spirits, and it would be nifty if other classes could hold ashes, since there are multiple classes that can enchant, and stance, why not have multiple classes that can do these things?

Maybe in Ch3 they will add ranger attacking spirits, Spirit of Legolas (hmmmm) etc which bow attack with you. And maybe Necros will hold ashes also. But as for now they are the quircks given to Ritualist to make them stand out.

I wonder why you sugest this, as personally I think it is probably flame-bait, Shardfenix raises a good point, although GW is a good game to play, if CH2 relied on it's storyline thats size or depth it would have floundered, likewise for people to buy Ch3 they have to introduce something (not necessarily new profs) that will make me want to buy it, because a "new storyline" isnt enough for me, not when they are, naff.

Your idea seems to me like you dislike the diversity that rits/assassins give to a team? going off your suggestion lets just take Ritu/Monk/Mesmer/Necro/Ele and combine them into one class, the Meta-physical caster class. and then we can take Ranger/Warrior/Asssassin and just combine them into the Physical class.

From these 2 classes you could then only select one attribute line to play from.

^ you see how this is a silly idea, and your diea strkes me the same, I see no problem with the diversity that the new classess bring. I myself have an Assassin and a Ritualist, and play my Ritu alot, they are so diverse, I think what your suggesting would turn alot of people away from GW, and even if every GW player in the world agreed to this, Anet would never do this anyway, and I think you know this. But just for a definitive answer
//Not Signed!

Kareem · Jul 18, 2006, 08:22 AM // 08:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by shardfenix

Wow. Simply...wow.
While you're at it, ask arenanet to not add new storylines, or new realms of the gods, or new skills, or new weapon sknis.
How about they release expansions with only new core professions skills. I'd certainly pay 50 bucks for that.
[/sarcasm]
Before I get banned for flaming again, i am not flaming. I am completely serious. The new professions are the ONLY reason people buy the expansions. I know I wouldn't want an expansion if all it gave me was a so-so story and crap core profession skills.

Darn straight. I'm with ya on that one

LaserLight · Jul 18, 2006, 08:34 AM // 08:34

Okay...Kai? Can I ask why you are against new professions? Back before people jumped you over it, you dumped on every concept character introduced in the Sanitarium, whether it was good or not, and now you want all new professions now and forever barred from the game in exchange for turning the cores into supermen.

Umm...why?

By your argument, it's to keep the game skill-based. Well guess what, if expansions added new attributes instead of new professions, or even if they just added lots of skills, you'd have the same problem you say we have now, that the game is based on how many expansions you have and not skill. Hell, it'd even be worse! Think about it - what happens when the core classes, under your model, get vital attributes or skills under a new expansion? As it stands now, core classes are still mostly viable without Factions. Booners still work, Cripshots still work, Death Necros still work, Warrs still work. You still get most of the viability of the profession, you just don't get Assassins and Ritualists. But if each new expansion drastically altered the performance of each profession...then people who skip an expansion but still want to play competitively are burgled. Your Tyrian/Canthan necromancer that skips Ch. 3 is no longer a viable Necromancer, because he's not just missing twenty-five skills, he's missing fifty, sixty, or more, and of an entirely new type. So now not only can't he play the new profession that no longer exists...he can't play as a competitive Necromancer anymore either.

Yeah, bad idea. Bad idea to the Nth degree. We're talking reelecting Bush-level bad idea. /Notsigned to a really high power.

kvndoom · Jul 18, 2006, 08:37 AM // 08:37

My only opinion, after seeing that (most, but not all) Assassins are laughably played like wammos (my gawd I've even seen some use Mending now), is that Anet SERIOUSLY consider not implementing another melee class into this game. Leeroy syndrome is too easy to acquire and too hard to cure, and is horribly detrimental to any type of team-based play.

arcanemacabre · Jul 18, 2006, 08:40 AM // 08:40

I can see it now. If the game originally only had Warrior, Ranger, Monk, and Elementalist, he'd be completely against the addition of a Necromancer and Mesmer. Argument? Well, we already have two physical and two spellcasters, it's balanced as is, just add new skills to these 4 existing characters.

Rubbish.

Makkert · Jul 18, 2006, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Sometimes suggestions in this forum can be of a rare quality.
This is one of them, I'm simply baffled by this super pointless suggestion. Do you really believe for a nanosecond that ANet will take this suggestion and implement it?